New Order Interview: Bernard Sumner, Stephen Morris & Gillian Gilbert Discuss New Album ‘Music Complete’

The title Music Complete sounds like an ending rather than a new beginning. Did you originally think this might be New Order’s last album? STEPHEN MORRIS: The title was supposed to be based on the musical style musique concrete. It was only afterwards we thought, Oh my God, it sounds a bit final. Music Complete has a lot of different things on it. It’s not all dance, it’s not all guitar; it’s a bit of everything, really. That’s why we thought it would be quite a good title, not because it’s going to be the last thing we do.

But if you were to decide to pack it in, you’d still have given the world two game-changing bands with Joy Division and New Order. So what makes you want to go back into the studio and make new music? BERNARD SUMNER: If you’re a creative person, the urge is always within you. It’s just a feeling you get, that you just feel like you want to write a song, or write a poem or do a drawing or a painting. I don’t really know where it comes from. Maybe it comes from not being good at anything else at school. I just know that by the time we came to write — after we’d played [live] pretty much all around the globe — we weren’t short of ideas. There was one point that Daniel came up and he held his head and went, “Oh! Too much music!”

Daniel, what were your initial thoughts about signing New Order to Mute? DANIEL MILLER: My first thought was, “Wow, that would be amazing.” My second thought was, “Fuck, I hope the music’s good.” Because it’s a long time since they’ve made a record. And, to be honest, my favorites of theirs were the earlier ones, the more iconic ones. I didn’t have a clue what to expect. So the first thing we did was, we went to meet the band. We’d met on many occasions over the years but never really spent a lot of time together, apart from one time in the ’80s when we had a long talk about synthesizers. Bernard offered to send me some music to listen to: “Plastic,” “Singularity,” “People On The Highline.” They were in their very early stages; they didn’t have vocals. What I heard, even then, was exactly how I had hoped it would sound: very fresh, very energetic. I don’t think it would’ve worked for us if it had been a retread of the old stuff without that kind of freshness and new energy.

BERNARD: Daniel’s been very involved in this record. He would come up to our writing space in Manchester. He visited three or four times to see how we’re getting on; then, when we mixed the album, he was there every day. He’s very hands on.

DANIEL: Apart from Tom Rowland, who worked on a few tracks, they had no producer. That can get tricky at certain points, because a band could lose focus of what they’re doing if there’s nobody there. My job was to make sure they didn’t lose focus.

In this iTunes world, listeners often cherry-pick tracks from an album rather than listening to them in order. To that end, which songs would you recommend fans check out first? GILLIAN: “Singularity”: It’s quite dark and mysterious; it sounds like classic New Order. And I love “The Game” because of Bernard’s vocals, and that’s a fantastic lyric he’s come up with. And “Stray Dog” because it’s got Iggy on it.

STEPHEN: I never thought we’d have Iggy singing on a New Order track! “Stray Dog” sounds like nothing we’ve done before. I’d also pick “Tutti Fruitti.” It reminds some people of “Fine Time,” although I can’t see it myself. It’s a happy song. It just makes you smile when you listen to it.

How did you get Iggy to appear on “Stray Dog”? BERNARD: I was watching TV with a glass of wine in one hand and a remote control in the other, and I started writing this poem — which is unusual for me, because I don’t write poetry. I ended up writing the words to “Stray Dog.” After working with Iggy — [he sang Joy Division’s “Love Will Tear Us Apart” with New Order at a fundraiser] in March 2014 in New York for the Tibet House organization — I thought, I can imagine Iggy on this. So I emailed him: “Would you like to work with us on this track?” I got an email back saying: “Hey Bernard. It’s Iggy. Sure. I can do this.” It was very succinct. He dug it, I guess.

Daniel, was there any concern about signing a legacy band who’d just lost arguably their most charismatic member in Peter Hook? DANIEL: To be honest, I didn’t think about it that much. I thought: It’s New Order, they’re making a new record, what’s it going to sound like?; I didn’t think: It’s New Order, they’re making a new record without Peter Hook, what’s it going to sound like? Of course, it’s sad when people are working together for so long and a key member leaves. But the thing you notice in those situations, the band that’s left behind, it can make them stronger and really pull them together.

How has the dynamic within the band changed in Hooky’s absence? BERNARD: There’s more freedom. The way we worked was, there was an imaginary hat on the table, and it was, “If you got any ideas, put them in the hat.” It could be anything from an intro to a verse to a chorus to a full song. Tom, for example, would go “Can I try playing that synth bass line on the bass guitar?” I’d go, “Sure. If it sounds better, we’ll keep it.” So there was discussion without fear of upsetting someone’s ego. You could go, “I don’t like that part,” and it wouldn’t be a big political thing within the band. That was very refreshing. There was a rule: If you criticized someone else’s [idea], then you go, “How about this instead?” I don’t want to say anything bad about what Hooky did. What he did in the past, it was great but not irreplaceable. But the working environment wasn’t great. It was difficult because of the clash of personalities. I’d read somewhere that he felt he’d reached the point where he couldn’t compromise anymore, and I understand that. He moved on. I hope he’s very happy in what he’s doing.

STEPHEN: The problem with Hooky was he liked the idea of writing stuff as a band, which is great, but we don’t jam as much now. The way that we write [now is primarily] with computers, and it’s very hard to do that kind of band-y thing.

GILLIAN: When I left to look after my daughter, I felt really bad because I had to leave something I really loved. I think Hooky probably [went] through that. He’s probably very angry that we’re still carrying on, but that’s life.

Gillian, what was that was like, being away from the band for a decade? It’s rare to hear from a woman in a classic band full-stop, and you’re one who had to choose motherhood over being a musician. GILLIAN: When we were making [the 2001 album] Get Ready, I had my second daughter. When she was 18 months old, she was completely paralyzed from the waist downwards. It ended up as being a virus on her spine. We were due to go to Japan and tour Get Ready, but my daughter needed so much physiotherapy, and I just wanted to stay with her. I spent most of the 10 years helping her get on her feet. She’s 15 now and quite independent. She walks, but she’s got splints on both legs. Then, in 2007, I got breast cancer. Five years later, when my health was coming back, they asked me to come back to New Order and do a couple of gigs. I feel a bit more positive about everything now — I just get on with life, take every day as it comes. New Order is like that now too. We don’t make massive plans. We didn’t really think that we’d be getting this far with the new line-up. So this record has been great for us. It’ll be interesting to see what happens next.

New Order’s new album Music Complete was released today (September 25). Read more or Lori Majerski’s writing by checking out her book Mad World: An Oral History of New Wave Artists and Songs That Defined the 1980s.